You seem to think that, by doubting that doubt is a form of thought, you can beat Cogito Ergo Sum. Argument 2 ( We need to establish that there is thought, doubt and everything to go ahead) Can a VGA monitor be connected to parallel port? So this is not absolute as well. . Argument 3:( We need to establish that there is thought, doubt and everything to go ahead) Descartes in his first assumption says that he is allowed to doubt everything. He broke down his argument against the Cogito into a series of assumptions that would have to be made before one could accept the statement ("I think, therefore I am") as true. How to draw a truncated hexagonal tiling? WebA brief overview of Ren Descartes's "I think; therefore, I am" argument. There is no warrant for putting it into the first person singular. Once that happens, is your argument still valid? You pose the following apparent contradiction and I gather that your question asks why it isn't considered to be a logical fallacy in Descartes' argument: Descartes in his first assumption says that he is allowed to doubt everything. You take as Descartes' "first assumption" the idea that one can doubt everything - but I would prefer to say that the cogito ergo sum is simply the /r/askphilosophy aims to provide serious, well-researched answers to philosophical questions. Are you even human? So we should take full advantage of that in our translations, Now, to the more substantive question. Perhaps the best way to approach this essay would be to first differentiate between the statements. discard thoughts being real because in dreams, "there is at that time not one of them true". There is no logical reason to question this again, as it is redundant. I think, therefore I am This is Descartes' famous Cogito argument: Cogito Ergo Sum. But Western philosophers rarely see past their thoughts to examine the 'I am' on which they depend. Answers must portray an accurate picture of the issue and the philosophical literature. The second thing these statements have in common, is that they lose sight of the broader evolution of human history. First, to Descartes "doubt is a thought" might be close to what Kant later called analytic, i.e. As long as either be an action, and I be performing them, then I can know I exist. Since you mention me, I'd like to point out that I was commenting on two things: One was the other commenter's setup, and the other was Descartes in general. It also means that I'm thinking, which also means that I exist. Descartes might have had a point if he said that our intuitive, non-discursive, non-deduced self-knowledge doesn't depend on recognition of prior principles of logic but the Cogito is meant as an argument not a pointing to our intuition. What is the relation between Descartes' "lumen naturale", God and logic? WebValid: an argument is valid if and only if it is necessary that if all of the premises are true, then the conclusion is true; if all the premises are true, then the conclusion must be true; it is impossible that all the premises are true and the conclusion is false. Press J to jump to the feed. This is the beginning of his argument. I thought in Philosophy we questioned everything. Respectfully, the question is too long / verbose. Descartes did not mean to do this, but establish a logic through which he can deduce existence not define it. What's the piece of logic here? " Let's take a deeper look into the ORDER of the arguments AND the assumptions involved. The argument is not paradoxical because "I can doubt everything" is simply where he starts, not a universal rule that is supposed to govern everything in the universe. Therefor the ability to complete this thought exercise shows that Descartes exists. Descartes Meditations: What are the main themes in Meditations on First Philosophy? This is absolutely true, but redundant. So let's doubt his observation as well. Answers should be reasonably substantive. It is established under prior two rules. Is there a flaw in Descartes' "clear and distinct" argument? The idea that doubt is more than thought (or ought to be to count) appears much later (in Peirce and other anti-Cartesians). To subscribe to this RSS feed, copy and paste this URL into your RSS reader. This is a thought exercise, that can be completed without the use of sight, sound, or any other sense. First two have paradoxical rules, therefore are not absolutely true(under established rules). Whether or not the 'I' is a human being, a semi-advanced computer simulation, or something else, is not relevant to cogito ergo sum in and of itself, nor is the name we choose to give to the action undertaken by the 'I'. An argument is valid iff* it is impossible for the premises of the argument to be true while the This short animation explains how he came to this conclusion of certainty But thats *not* what Descartes cogito ergo sum says: it says *if* you think, you must exist; it does *not* say that if something exists, Youve committed the formal fallacy of affirming the consequent ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Affirming_the_consequent ) This actually has amusing consequences, as you are basically interpreting Descartes to say only thinking things can exist, which means in order for, for instance, a rock to exist, it must think. He says, Now that I have convinced myself that there is nothing in the world no sky, no earth, no minds, no bodies does it follow that I dont exist either? Lecturer in Philosophy, University of Dayton. I think; therefore, I am is perhaps the most famous phrase in all of philosophy (perhaps even more so now due to a certain hit single). mistake or anyone clearly admitting Descartes's. If we're trying to measure validity syllogistically we fail, because Descartes purposefully avoids syllogistic logic here. Thanks for the answer! Reddit and its partners use cookies and similar technologies to provide you with a better experience. WebThat's why I think it's wrong to purchase and consume meat." 0 This passage contains a valid "multiple modus ponens" argument with the following logical form: 1. p 2. p -> q 3. q -> r. 4. For Descartess argument to work, I would need to make a contradictory second assumption, which would be Doubt is definitely thought, and I cannot doubt that. Let B be the object: Thought, Descartes's Idea: I can apply A to all objects except B, because even if I am able to apply it to B, A is also B, and hence B for sure is, therefore " I am". WebInteresting, same argument could hold valid for all modern technological inventions or innovations since the Wheel - however mankind has always progressed and But validity is not enough for a conclusion to be true, also the argument has to be solid: the premises have to be true. This is where the cogito argument enters, to save the day. There is no logical reason to doubt your existence if you can question your existence as you are required to pose the question. I will read it a few times again, just that I am recovering from an eye surgery right now. as in example? No deceiver has ever been found within experience using the scientific method. He uses a What factors changed the Ukrainians' belief in the possibility of a full-scale invasion between Dec 2021 and Feb 2022? Can a VGA monitor be connected to parallel port? He may not be able to doubt that "doubt is a thought" either, on the basis of analyticity, but again, this is moot. This is an interactive blog post, where the philosophyzer gives you a stimulus and questions, and asks you to provide the answers! I am not saying if doubt is thought or not! Descartes first says that "I can doubt everything". I do not agree with his first principle at all. It is perhaps better summarized as I doubt, so I think; therefore, I am.. I hope this helped you understand the phrase I think; therefore, I am and its role in epistemology (the study of knowledge). However, it isn't a sound argument: since the premise has not been shown to be true, especially considering the project of radical scepticism that Descartes is engaged in. That everything is a superset which includes observation or "doubting that doubt is thought", because doubt is thought comes from observation. @infatuated. WebHe broke down his argument against the Cogito into a series of assumptions that would have to be made before one could accept the statement ("I think, therefore I am") as true. Do you even have a physical body? You appear to think that you have found a paradox of sorts, but you haven't actually done that. If I attempt to doubt my own existence, then I am thinking. 2. In this the logic has a paradoxical rule. I am saying that I need not make the second assumption, and I can establish the statement I think, therefore I must be, without that second assumption. Did it mean here that doubt was thought or doubt was not thought? Educators go through a rigorous application process, and every answer they submit is reviewed by our in-house editorial team. There are none left. I can add A to B before the sentence and B to A before it infinitely. Not a chance. Which is what we have here. Do you not understand anything I say? [duplicate]. Whether you call 'doubt' a form of thought or not, is wholly irrelevant to the conclusion that something exists, and Descartes chooses to call that something 'I'. Now all A is a type of B, and all B requires C. (Doubt is a subcategory of thought, and thinking is an action that cannot happen without a thinker.) In the Cogito argument the existence of I and each of the concepts are presumed because even though I can doubt for example that the external world exists, but I can't doubt that the concept of "external world" exists in my mind as well as all concepts in the Cogito statement, and since all of these are subordinate to my mind I can then deduce my own existence from those perceptions. [] At last I have discovered it thought! But if I say " Doubt may or may not be thought", since this statement now exhausts the universe, then there is no more assumption left. Before that there are simply three quantities or things we know we are comparing each other with. Great answer. One of commonly pointed out reasons is the inserting of the "I". And that holds true for coma victims too. Just wrote my edit 2. No it is not, you are just in disagreement with it, because you mentally would prefer your handhanded and have certainty on a realm where certainty is hard to come-by. And will answer all your points in 3-4 days. NO. For the present purpose, I am only concerned with the validity of the slippery slope argument Dealing with hard questions during a software developer interview. My observing his thought. ( Logic for argument 2). I've flagged this as a duplicate as it now appears you will continue making this thread until someone agrees with you. What are the problems with this aspect of Descartes philosophy? Therefore, the statement "I think" is still based on individual perception and lacks substantiation. Therefore, I exist. There is NO logic involved at all. Hi, you still have it slightly wrong. Looking at Descartes, does the temporality of consciousness justify doubt in it? (2) If I think, I exist. There for since Descartes is thinking he must exist. I think you are conflating his presentation with his process - what we read is his communication with us, not the process of reasoning/logic in itself. But, much more importantly, "cogito ergo sum" doesn't appear at all in the strongest formulation of Descartes' argument, The Second Meditation. In this argument, propositions (1) and (2) are premises and proposition (3) is a conclusion. We can say that it is the first assumption or starting point of his reason, that he can doubt everything. Rule 1 clashes with Rule 2. Way to approach this essay would be to first differentiate between the statements sound, or any other.... This aspect of Descartes Philosophy uses a what factors changed the Ukrainians ' belief in the possibility of a invasion! Observation or `` doubting that doubt is thought or not and logic was. Doubt is thought comes from observation know I exist perhaps the best way approach. Doubt was thought or doubt was thought or doubt was not thought problems this. 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